Starters

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Original submission by Jacks:

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Photo by Jacks. Click to enlargen

Starters:

Starter Motor Description:

Bosch BXH137 Planetary Reduction Starter. Fits red/blue/black 6's. Big improvement in efficiency means longer Battery life. Very affordable price to buy new. It's thinner so it's easier to fit behind extractors than the old style direct drive model. Checkout ReaperHR's Shed for fitting instructions. Click to enlargen. Photo by ReaperHR.

The 4 Brush Starter Motor is a little different in the details as described here but in theory can be used as advised in the 2 Brush Starter Motor listed below.

173 Trimatic Starter Plate. Starter wear patterns are near each of the 3 large outer indented holes that hold the Torque-Converter.  Click to enlargen. Photo by T.

Interchangeability Of Red/Blue/Back Six Cylinder Starters:


By hushtech 27/06/16@09:16 4035
Yes they are all interchangeable, however the commodore for memory are shorter, therefore good with extractors because of lack of room. End of submission by Hushtech.

Teeth wear on a 173 Trimatic Flex Plate. In extreme cases the teeth will be completely torn away. A good Battery and good electrics is the best insurance against this problem. Click to enlargen. Photo by T.
Starter Solenoid. Some Solenoids have 2 low current connections. The topmost one (when installed) provides a  direct connection for the Ignition Coil under cranking. Click to enlargen. Photo by JackS.
Teeth wear on a 173 Trimatic Starter Plate. The wear pattern is determined by the number of cylinders. Four = 180 degrees,  Sixes = 120 degrees, V8's = 90 degrees. Click to enlargen. Photo by T.
Starter Ringear on a Manual UC Torana. This gave screeching sounds during cranking. Click to enlargen. Photo by Toranasaurus.
Starter Plate Wear on a Trimatic WB. Note the tooth wear. Click to enlargen. Photo by Ben.
Starter Test. 1. Make sure the Handbrake is firmly applied and the Car is in Neutral (Manual Gearbox)  or Park (Automatic Gearbox).  2. Keep your Hands and Body Parts clear of any rotating items like the Fan. 3. Remove the purple Wire from the Starter Solenoid and remove the Coil Lead out of the centre of the Distributor so that the Engine cannot fire while you do the test.  4. Make sure the Ignition is turned OFF. 5. Hold an insulated Screwdriver by the Handle and short the large connector on the right to the small one in the lower centre (where the purple Wire was connected).  Click to Enlargen. Image by MattsEHute.
Further Starter Test Steps. 6. If the Starter cranks the Engine OK there is a Wiring Problem or a faulty Ignition Switch. 7. If the Starter doesn't crank the Engine OK the Starter needs replacing.  Click to Enlargen. Image by MattsEHute.

More starter images are in Jacks' shed under Starters .

Troubleshooting:

The Starter Doesn't Activate in the Start Position:

See the Starter Test Image on this page.

A Screech Occurs When I Try to Crank the Engine:

Weak Battery, Poor Starter Plate
Submitted by T on Sat, 16/06/2007 - 09:04.
The screech noise occurs due to teeth that have been stripped from starter ring gear in one of the three locations that a 6 cylinder engine always stops.
Sometimes the original starterplate was weak and other times it's caused by the engine being in poor tune with a weak battery. With a weak Battery, every time the engine gets near TDC the battery craps out and weakens the ignition making it harder to start.
At the same time the starter gear jumps in and out because there is insufficient power to hold it engaged and the starter pinion successfully tears the teeth out of the starter plate as it does so. A workarond is to activate the Starter for 1 second then release the Key. Wait until any sound from the Starter has stopped, then do a normal start. You may need to do the 1 second long burst 2 or 3  times if the Starter Plate or Ring-Gear is very worn. T  

Mild Ring Gear wear caused by Starter Pinion engagement. In extreme cases the Teeth are missing altogether. As a result the Starter does not turn the Engine. Click to enlargen. Photo by HQ_SS.
Red flywheeel on left Blue Flywheel on right. Click to enlargen. Photo and info by HQ_SS.
Lightened Flywheel. Click to enlargen. Photo and info by HQ_SS.

End of submission by T.

The Starter Solenoid Just Clicks:

This is a very common fault which is most often caused by high resistance in the Electrical System.

Look under
Dim Lights Cranky Starters
for circuit faults.
Battery Terminals must be clean, tight and covered with Electrical Grease.
The circuit from the starter switch can become resistive and fail to provide the Starter Solenoid with enough current to activate correctly and this causes the click. This situation is best fixed by fitting a starter relay. See your autosparky. Another common cause of a clicking solenoid is Starter Motor brushes on their way out.
The car's Earths are critical as well. Look in Dim Lights Cranky Starters
for further details on Earths and cabling.
If all this stuff checks out, then troubleshoot your Starter. You don't want to replace a perfect Starter because the car's Electrical Leads were due for retirement.

The Engine Kicks Back:

Often the Starter gets blamed for an excessively advanced Ignition timing.
Also modern fuels, particularly Premium Un-Leaded Petrol can be ignited by glowing spark plug electrodes
under hot cranking even when the ignition is turned off causing the Engine to kick back.

The workaround is to flood the Engine by pressing the accelerator pedal 3 or 4 times, then perform a flooded start. The excess fuel will quench any glowing surfaces.
The excessive advance may be caused by loose and worn out Balance Weights inside the Distributor.

As a test and with the Ignition turned off, remove the Coil wire from the centre of the Distributor and tie it to earth with wire. Then crank the Engine. If the Engine cranks normally, there is excessive advance which will have to be remedied. This problem may be caused by a worn out Distributor.

Starter Motor Growling Out
Symptoms
Starter motor not turning very fast sound/feels like flat battery, bad connection or even the lights start to dim out, feels like shorting out.

Remedy

Remove the Battery Leads, then remove the wires from the Solenoid Switch, taking note of what comes from what and what goes on to what connection, then remove the holding bolts of the Starter Motor Body connected to the Bell Housing.

Dismantling the Starter Motor:

Once you have removed the end plate, check the bronze bushes in both ends,
as the bushes have very thin walls and since the motor is near the exhaust system
the bushes can dry out, these bushes are “ Oil Impregnate Bushes��? and can chop out when dry, usually just on one side of the bush, as a rule, it's usually the drive end (the end bolted to the bell housing)as its not protected and gets all the dust etc from the clutch plate, as well as the heat.

To Replace Them:

Will only cost a few dollars for new ones, also if the carbon brushes are worn, then replace them as well, these are only a few dollars more, and can be sought from any good auto electrician,

Important
As these Bronze bushes are self impregnated with oil, it's best to let them soak in light engine oil for 24 hrs or 2 hours if the oil is hot,100c
There is a quicker method that I use, balance the bush end on your thumb print, fill the bush with oil then with the forefinger and thumb, squeeze so the oil starts to come out the sides of the bush, best to repeat (3 times).
Don’t forget to check the other end, if the bush is not worn, then it's still a good idea to oil that bush as well.
Note
Don’t ever ream the bushes out as it will impair the porosity of the bush and will cause early failure
Commutator
Hold armature in vise jaws with soft wood or heavy cardboard, not to tight, don't want to crush the stamping on the armature, then with a long strip of v/fine emery cloth/paper, loop it over the copper/commutator then holding the ends of the emery cloth/paper, in each hand work up and down like a see saw effect, just enough to clean/polish the commutator, turn the shaft 1/4 turn and repeat till all done.
Cleaning up
Next, clean the rubbish out of the commutator slots, use tooth pick, or match stick,(copper with slots that brushes run on)check the carbon Brushes as well, and blow all the dust out of the yoke casing etc,
If no air compressor use a length of small diameter plastic /rubber tube and blow ,watch your eyes, ok,
Reassemble
Now its all been put back together again, you did take note on what went where, best to take pics as you go as you never know when the misses calls you and the time you get back , well say no more. Yes, digital pics the way to go, will save ,time , memory, frustration etc.

Summing Up

So by doing some early maintenance from time to time it will save you the trouble later on , as breaking down on the highway or away from the work shop, can be darn annoying. And may save you a few dollars,

See Jacks Sheds for pics on [starters] and part details on the 4 Brush Starter Motor for L6 Engine, have also added pics and details of the four brush Bosch Starter Motor,the principles are mainly the same as the Lucas.

Bosch v Lucus
Main difference being, in revs not under load , the Lucas does 8,500 rpm and the Bosh 7,200 rpm,
Engine cranking speed
Is 120 rpm for both.
Cheers Jacks.

Starter Motors Lucas and Bosch
Starter motors on all series are basically the same in their operating principles, however they do change in construction between makes and models for the various series.
From 1948 to 1953 they were equipped with the 6 volt system, and all subsequent series have the 12 volt system.
Listed below are a few facts and specifications that might help you.

Solenoid Switch
The solenoid switch is attached to the starter.
When the solenoid windings are energized, there’s a plunger that activates a lever and pivot. That then in turn engages the drive pinion onto the flywheel ring gear, and at the same time, closes the switch supplying the power from the positive lead off the battery to the starter motor field coils to operate the starter motor.

Overriding Clutch.
The overriding clutch plays an important roll as it prevent the high speed rotation of the starter motor. Also the solenoid windings are not immediately de-energized by releasing the push button or the key switch.
Note
Never wash the drive assembly clutch in solvent as it will destroy the clutch lubricant and cause early failure of the unit.
Commutator
Check the condition of the commutator, you can polish with a strip of fine emery paper , clean out the dirt/dust slots with a tooth pick or match, if need be undercut on a lathe but do not undercut the mica insulation between the commutator .

Delco-Remy
To adjust the drive pinion engaged connect the positive lead of the battery to the battery terminal on the solenoid and disconnect the connector from the other terminal on the solenoid to the starter field terminal.

Connect a jumper lead from the battery terminal on the solenoid to the starter button switch terminal on the solenoid relay, and earth the other terminal of the relay.
Earth the other lead of the battery to the starter frame and push the solenoid plunger in by hand.
With the plunger held in this position by the hold-in coil on the solenoid, adjust the plunger adjusting screw so that there is 1/8��? between the inner face of the drive end bracket bearing boss and the face of the drive pinion, with the pinion assembly held in lightly to remove all the slack from the plunger linkage.
If this dimension is not correct ,adjust by screwing the link in or out of the solenoid plunger as necessary, disconnect the battery and restore the original connections.
Lucas
To adjust the drive pinion engaged connect a 6 volt battery and switch in series with the field terminal on the starter motor body and the small screw on the solenoid.
Bring the drive pinion to the engaged position by closing the test switch and then lightly press the pinion towards the released position to take up any slack in the engaging lever mechanism
Measure the distance from the engaging face of the pinion to the mounting flange face of the drive end bracket, the measurement of 5/8��? pinion face to mounting flange with pinion engaged.
If adjustment is necessary, loosen the lock nut on the engaging lever eccentric pivot pin the pin in the required direction to obtain the correct setting
Note
The arrow on the slotted end of the pivot pin and the range of the adjustment available,
Then after adjustment tighten the eccentric pin nut.
Disconnect the test battery and switch
Note
Do not use a higher voltage than 6 volts in order to avoid over heating the closing wining of the solenoid so carry out the rest as quickly as possible.
Bosch
to adjust solenoid pull rod clevis, energize the hold-in winding of the solenoid so the solenoid plunger will be held in the engaged position. To do this, connect the positive terminal of a 12 volt battery to the small switch terminal of the solenoid and the negative terminal of the battery to the solenoid body. Note use a 6 volt battery where the system is 6 volts.
Measure the distance from the centre of the pull rod clevis pin to the face of the solenoid mounting flange.
Submission by Jacks.  

Holden 308 V8 Starter. Note the Starter bolts onto  the Engine Block near the Sump seam and not into the Bellhousing.  Photo by Robbie Godwin. Click to Enlargen.

 

Starter Models Per Car:

 

Holden Model
Starter Brand
 Starter Model   Adjustment Notes
 48/215  Delco Remy  1109601  Solenoid pull rod adjustment : Adjust to obtain 1/8 “between bearing face and end pinion.
  FJ  Bosch : Make and Model : Bosch : EEDO.4/6R  Bosch : Make and Model : Bosch : EEDO.4/6R  Solenoid pull rod length, centre of link pin to attaching plate : 1- 9/32��? with solenoid plunger fully engaged.
 FE, FC  Bosch  EEDO.8/12R   Solenoid pull rod length, centre of link pin to attaching plate : 1- 9/32��? with solenoid plunger fully engaged.
 FB, EK, EJ   Bosch   EEDO.8/12R37  Solenoid pull rod length, centre of link pin to attaching plate. 1- 9/32��? with solenoid plunger fully engaged.
 FB, EK, EJ  Lucas   M 35G  Adjustment, solenoid lever pivot pin : 5/8��? pinion face to mounting flange face with pinion engaged
  EH   Bosch   EEDO.8/12R52 (149) AL/EGF 1/2R13 (179)  
  HD, HR   Bosch  EEDO.8/12R52 (149) AL/EGF 1/2R13 (179)  
 HD, HR  Lucas    Adjustment : Lucas Solenoid lever eccentric pivot pin, .010��? from pinion face to shaft collar with pinion fully engaged.
 HD, HR   Bosch  EEDO.8/12R52 (149) AL/EGF 1/2R13 (179)   * Only HR Series vehicles are equipped with Bosch Starter model U-GF-R-12VIPS.
       
       
       
       
       
       
       
       
       
       

   
See Jacks Sheds for pics on starters and part details on the 4 Brush Starter Motor L6 Engine, cheers Jacks.  

Starter Motor on a grey Holden Engine. Photo by 1962_EJ. Click to Enlargen.
HX 202 Ring Gear Teeth Damage. Photo by Halholden. Click to Enlargen.

V8 Starters:

V8 Starters

Links:

Sarter Ring-gear Replacement.

Bosch Hi Torque Starter

Starter Operation 1

Starter Operation 2

Starter Overhaul

HZCambridge's Shed

V8 Starters

Toranasaurus' Link

ReaperHR's Guides

V8 Starter Motor Interchangeability Thread

Further V8 Starter Motor Interchangeability Thread

HX 202 Ring Gear Teeth Damage Thread

Terms:

Terms

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